All posts by Wallata
I do wish Fandom just banned these people or started reviewing their behaviour. Unfortunately they can run it whatever they want as long as they're admins. They have power and they use it however they want. Well the guilt of their own wrongdoings being pointed out will make them quit hopefully.
Blame @Arise Etrigan the agressive mod and his defenders @Tupka217 and @N8THGR852 The latest per Nate is I and others were responsible for everything wrong.
Nevermind they talk about burden of proof when Etrigan asked AFDurbin1 who wasn't even arguing or claiming something as correct, to provide proof. These people need to blocked permanently. Saying the truth is not an attack but N8 doesn't care. Though he'll be busy making up things like a post probably being locked up for verbal attack lol.
This wiki is a mess and needs to be cleaned up.
Let me point out the difference. If I tell someone "go bring me water", that if not a request. Request will be if I asked "Can you bring me water?" or "please give me water". If I said "give me money" that is not a request. Request is if I say like "Please give me money" or "I need money" and make it SOUND like I need it.
Please don't kid yourselves. If Etty has a knack for being agressive, I suggest you warn him to stop it instead of letting it continue. A formal debate may require you to counter the point. Is such a situation here? But even there a person can just choose to just walk out or stop participating, it's his right. No one in an informal casual setting is required to do anything.
And thing is this is not a debate. Etty was simply goading him to claim he's right and the other is wrong. A real debate will require proof on his own part. Etty has provided none. "If you can provide citation where they do refer to metahumans as a subspecies then I’m happy to concede that point".
And even in a formal debate you shouldn't tell anyone anything, but request politely. You don't turn it into an argument of claiming I'm right and you're wrong. You show you're right only by your assertions and evidence to back it up. Nothing else. Learn how to "debate" first.
Besides if Etrigan just searched for one minute, he'd have known he was wrong. Metahumans are treated differently both in and outside the fictional universe.
So who's to blame for Etrigan coming to proclaim his opinion is correct without researching? He himself. If you don't want stop people from being aggressive why are you a mod then.
Whatever their reason, why are you arguing? If they don't want to do anything against him, they won't. What do you have to reap from it? Then you'll say I'm hijacking the thread while arguing yourself endlessly.
"The request is there, even if not in the form of a question."
Thing is that claim doesn't gell with Etrigan himself saying he only said it because he believes he is correct. He's goading him and claiming he's incorrect.
And I suggest you learn the meaning of request: "an act of asking politely or formally for something." There's no asking, there's no politeness. You're wasting your time defending the indefensible.
Pointing out the facts about someone's behaviour is not agressive, please don't play "turn the tables".
"You state it, so you have to source it."
Right to free expression involves not reply to anyone that too over someone thinking their personal opinion is correct.
Asking someone for evidence as a request in a polite way is one thing, telling them to do it is another. I don't complain because Etrigan asked, it's because he TOLD him to present it. In what world is this a polite manner of request:
"First, cite an example of where “metahumans” are treated as a subspecies in the comics if you’re going to deal with absolutes."
That's not even close to asking or requesting. And this is further reinforced by his own comment, that he simply is saying it to mean that the other side is wrong:
"If you can provide citation where they do refer to metahumans as a subspecies then I’m happy to concede that point..."
No one has to be accurate here. It's comics, not news. Besides Etrigan could learn he was wrong by simply searching on Wikipedia.
"Attack" and "hijacked"? Ironic. Thing is I criticized Arise Etrigan for "telling" someone what to do. That's not attack or hijack, it's pointing out that he seems to be bossing people around.
I called the admins and mods to do something about him, then one of them (only Tupka) and a few other users (like you) started arguing with me to defend him. The only reason I argued because I see his behavior as out of line.
So it's not me you should be blaming. You aren't even an admin who can do anything. If they feel he's wrong, they'll say it. Why are you even defending him when I'm asking the admin to punish him? Sure it's an open forum, you can go where you want. Eventually either you or I'll stop arguing, it's pointless.
A lot of people might make noise. But to me the character is more fundamental than appearence. Otherwise you're just creating something new under an old name if you change the personality in a reboot.
As much as I like the post-Crisis Superman, I disagreed with him not being the loser wimpy dork he was for 50 years while in his Clark disguise including in front of Lois.
It was supposed to represent Superman's fear of revealing himself even to his lady love and thus going to ridiculous attempts to hide it. This was fixed post Infinite Crisis.
@Arise Etrigan You want to know what happened? You said this:
"First, cite an example of where “metahumans” are treated as a subspecies in the comics if you’re going to deal with absolutes."
You talk as if he HAS to do it. You didn't say it as a request. You should have said "can you please cite an example" or just "please"? Maybe add "I don't remember it".
AFDurbin1 already told you "And I don't care that it is conjecture." Yet you ask him for proof. And thing is you didn't ask him because you were inquisitive, but because you didn't want to concede a point.:
"If you can provide citation where they do refer to metahumans as a subspecies then I’m happy to concede that point,"
You do not disengage. You just come to engage and create trouble.
How is not responding to someone demanding evidence repeatedly for something equal to someone asking for help for a necessary thing? Besides it's okay to ask for a pencil nicely. But if you keep asking for pencil then you're being rude yourself as you don't consider: a) what the other person wants, b) that the teacher might scold someone for creating noise (happened to me when I was a kid).
Besides you don't need "evidence" like you need pencil for work. The former is not a necessity, the other is in school for taking notes or giving tests. Any other example?
Why should I continue talking on something I don't want to? A person electing to stay quiet is not rude. How is someone being silent "not polite"? If you want your opinion satisified, no one has to.
@ScavengerOne Sure you can do what you want. But you do agree that when you demand proof, no one has to give you? Even if you're a mod.
I agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying about unity and peace but people like Arise Etrigan are only interested in themselves and their opinions.
Yes you did say others have to fulfill requests, "If you think just because this is a forum you don't have to ignore requests for sources, you're in the wrong place."
Secondly in a free society or a casual chat no one has to do anything. If you don't like it, well get over it. But that's not the truth. You're just making whatever excuse you can to defend Arise Etrigan.
@Tupka217 And where is it said that anyone has to fulfill anyone's request? This forum is just a place to chat and talk about DC comics. Do you see anything mandating to fulfill anyone's "request" (or should I say ordering around)? There's nothing. So quit making it up. The only one in the wrong place is you, trying your utmost to defend your pal.
Not gonna work. You're not gonna see from my POV and I certainly won't see from your POV. So let's leave it at that. If you think you can make people reply, you shouldn't be here.
@Tupka217 "The request for sources is not unusual. [Citation Needed] is the cornerstone of wikis, and that attitude seems absent on regular forums."
Nobody's supposed to satisfy his opinion. Citation needed is a part of articles. There's no such thing in forums, I don't see it in the guidelines. Forums are usually a place to discard fomalities (except civil behavior) and just have a chat.
Durbin stated he doesn't care "its conjecture". He has the right to not care and make conjectures. In fact he can even lie. There's nothing against it, this ain't no edit or article business, just a casual debate.
"Four points have been raised in this discussion, and shoved aside."
Arise Etrigan raised those points, no one's supposed to fulfill his wish. And let me quote Etrigan who said I shouldn't tell anyone what to do, right or wrong etc. But this standard disappeared for him and even you. Yes they're shoved aside because Etrigan nor anyone has any authority to make anyone do anything.
Now that said you ask about sources. But proving this was so easy that the only one to blame is you.
Suicide Squad's first issue in 1987 itself mentions that superhumans can be more easily imprisoned unlike normal humans.
Superman: Secret Origins has the US Army attacking Superman because he's an alien (with superpowers). General Lane distrusts as soon as he learns about him without knowing he's alien. It's only when he saves people from being killed that anyone bothers standing by him except Lois.
It's as simple as reading it on Wikipedia. And I don't think you or Etrigan don't remember Superman: Secret Origins. This isn't even about the overall discrimination superheroes face and are just a few examples, but ones you can easily find.
@Tupka217 Who is he to ask for sources? And demand to tell him? Why should we make him "happy"? This is not an article nor he is some special case to demand happiness.
You're defending him with ridiculous reasons. If you're partial to him, you can come out and bluntly say it, better the truth than an act. It's not the first time admins and mods have been partial to each other.
I'm calling the administrators and mods for Etrigan's behaviour. This is at least the third person to complain against him in last 24 hours and I'm sure others have complained about him in the past too. He should be stripped of his mod powers at the least.
@Kyletheobald @Haroldrocks @Tupka217 @SforHope @N8THGR852 Clearly Arise Etrigan's bad behaviour isn't someone's personal opinion. He habitually intends to escalate on discussions he strongly disagrees with and tries to order people around himself (while complaining of others telling people what to do).
@Arise Etrigan You telling someone to do something WAS out of line. Who exactly are you that people have to satisfy your opinion?