Talk: Arrowverse Characters

New reality designation for Arrow/Flash characters?

With the Flash series coming to the CW in the fall spinning out of Arrow, should there be a new name for their shared universe? It would look strange for all the Flash series characters to have pages with (Arrow) in the name. DrJohnnyDiablo (talk) 16:00, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

What name would you suggest? --Tupka²¹⁷ 16:02, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

(CW)? Not ideal because Smallville was also on the CW. Maybe someone has a better idea. DrJohnnyDiablo (talk) 16:09, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

Arrowverse? --Lucien61 (talk) 18:00, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

I don't like fanon names like that (like Arkham- or Dakota-). --Tupka²¹⁷ 18:02, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

Oh dear - this is not a fannish page? ;-)

Anyway, there´s no accounting for taste. Any better suggestions, though? --Lucien61 (talk) 18:25, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

I agree that this universe needs a new name. I think anything that is directly tied to Arrow like "Arrowverse" isn't the direction we should go. I think we should definitely do something with the fact that they're both going to be on the CW, even if Smallville was on the network, too. I'm alright with the plain old "CW" tag. Earth-CW? Earth-2012 CW? 2012 Earth-CW? Etc. Any other options would be appreciated because I really don't want all the Flash characters with the "Arrow" brand. --- Haroldrocks talk 20:49, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

"Earth-" is an old and ugly covnention and we don't want that anymore. "Arrowverse" is just "Arrow" with more letters. At this moment, the (Arrow) designation suffices IMO. --Tupka²¹⁷ 21:10, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

I still disagree. I think even (Arrow/Flash) or (Arrow/Flash Universe) would be better. Of course, if the CW adds more spinoffs in the future, all bets are off. Maybe (CW Universe)? DrJohnnyDiablo (talk) 21:28, May 10, 2014 (UTC)

There is also the option of "Berlantiverse", assuming the production company, Berlanti Productions, doesn't change. That's not that far off of what we did with Donner, Burton, and Nolan...

- Byfield (talk) 00:20, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

To be totally honest, I don't like those either. And we don't use "Timmverse" or "Diniverse" either. CW universe is out as they also had Smallville, and possibly some more series in the future that aren't in this continuity. --Tupka²¹⁷ 00:46, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

The material that would have been tagged "Timmverse" or "Diniverse" had an official designation in place by the time this got rolling. So that is moot. And my preference with the three would have been "1970s Superman Film Franchise", "1990s Batman Franchise", and "2000s Batman Film Franchise", but the likely hood of that gaining support is low.

We've really got limited options, so "It's fannish sounding" may not be a good enough reason to strike an option.

- Byfield (talk) 01:39, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

The designation should be based on the mothership series the expanding franchise is based on. So, CW is out since Smallville is, so far, unconnected to Arrow which is serving as the mothership right now. (We are talking Thom Holbrook groups here.) May I suggest CWA if Arrowverse is not finding favor? -Lucien61 (talk) 09:25, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

Do you mean "CW Arrow"? Is that what the "A" is for? (I assume that's what it means but I want to make sure we're on the same page.) --- Haroldrocks talk 13:22, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

CWA/CW Arrow/CW Arrowverse has the same problem as "Arrow" and "Arrowverse" - it would be damn awkward when appled to characters, settings, and things that don't appear in Arrow. Right now that is limited to Flash, however, IIRC, Berlanti has suggested that they may try to fold Green Lantern in. I think that may play hobs with a "Thom Holobrook group" (though I'd love it if some one would add a link defining that term).

What we've got as options, as near as I can tell:

1. "Arrow" - Currently in use and problematic when the direct spin-off Flash starts to air.
2. "Arrowverse" - Same issue as 1.
3. "CW" or "CW Universe" - If these these two shows were all the DC related material that CW has aired, no problem. Howevere... Smallville
4. "CWA" (either "CW Arrow" or "CW Arrowverse") - It would clarify CW, but it has the same problem as 1 and 2.
5. "Arrow/Flash" - Awkward, but it could work. At least until a 3rd show is added or or they follow through on the promise/threat of tying in Green Lantern.
6. "CW 2012 Universe" or "CW 2010s Universe" - A little awkward, but more useable than the other CW options. Currently consistent with the totality of the linked properties.
7. "Berlantiverse" - As consistent with the content as 6. It is also consistent with how we've handled the 1970s Superman and the 1990s and 2000s Batman film sets. The biggest drawback is that it's a fannish term.

Any others?

- Byfield (talk) 14:08, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

"CWA" is indeed intended to mean CW Arrow - just as an abbreviation for that TV universe of which Arrow is the first show. As for Thom Holbrook, there is this strangely addictive list the guy compiled: [1]. His 39 groups are linked at the bottom of that page. ---Lucien61 (talk) 16:59, May 11, 2014 (UTC)

I really don't see the problem about using CW Universe. What about Smallville? It has it's own designation (Smallville universe) and it didn't even start airing on the CW, beginning on the WB rather. It's like arguing that we shouldn't use DCAU because there were earlier DC animated shows and people might get confused and think we were including them too. Completely flies in the face of common sense. Tec15 (talk) 08:11, May 12, 2014 (UTC)

Primarily, DC uses, if no coined, DC Animated Universe and set what it includes. This puts it in the same category of "Earth-One", "Earth-S", "Earth-4", "Earth 2", and so on - official designations we're taking from the publisher. Those situations are different from what we have here. This is a case of the fans trying to find a short, reasonable way to say "The continuity comprised of interlined television shows produced by Berlanti Productions starting in 2012" to organize thing on this wikia. - Byfield (talk) 10:48, May 12, 2014 (UTC)

Now that the series has actually debuted, would it suffice to have something like DC New Televised Universe (DCNTU)? Or CW New Universe (CWNU)? This refutes the Smallville argument by making it distinct from Smallville's continuity. TheD3xus (talk) 01:32, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Guys, why don't we just call label the series (Flash 2014 TV Series) for now? We'll all still know it's a shared universe. And that would be just until we get an actual designation. Just a suggestion. And I like Dexus' suggestions by the way, I was actually talking to the head admin of the Arrow Wiki, about making a wiki with a similar name if the Titans show comes to light, and shares a universe with Arrow and The Flash. Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 01:34, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

I'm not a fan of the separate "Flash" tag. We'll know it's a shared universe, but the average reader won't. I'm agreeable to Dexus's tags but, in my opinion, my favorite is just a simple CW-based one. Tec made a couple good points above. (tl;dr: Smallville has its own designation. It didn't even start on the CW. We don't have a problem with the DCAU despite there being multiple DC animated features before the universe's existence.) I want to cross the Titans bridge when we come to it. To avoid using a CW universe designation just because a show might be in the same reality seems foolish. --- Haroldrocks talk 01:47, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Have they said what networks the Titans show will be on? If it's not CW, it's highly unlikely it will be in the same universe. Same thing with Constantine, Gotham and the new Supergirl series (NBC, Fox, and CBS respectively); these shows won't be in the same universe by default, unless they're explicitly said to do so. I do happen to like CWNU, because DCNTU would be misleading and encompass the shows I mentioned. CWNU narrows it down to just the CW. TheD3xus (talk) 01:54, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

I don't even need the "N"! I'm fine with just "CWU". But, before we make any decisions, we should wait for the other admins to wake up. They're going to want a piece of this. --- Haroldrocks talk 02:02, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Another thing: The {{Arrow}} template would have to be edited accordingly. I'll do that when we reach a consensus on the universe name. TheD3xus (talk) 02:18, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Actually I think they will. With all the appearances and crossovers, it would take someone who had just heard about the show not to know it's in a spinoff and in the same universe. And to counter your point Dexus, TNT is owned by Warner Bros, and the CW is partially owned by Warner Bros, therefore meaning they could still be in the same universe. I don't know the specifics but Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and spinoff show of Buffy did the same exact thing, being on two separate networks, yet in the same universe. Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 02:28, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Anything could happen. TNT (for the Titans show from what I gather) could be in the same universe as the Arrow shows (which would further complicate the name of the universe. D: ) But the other networks (NBC, Fox and CBS) are separate networks. Titans comes the closest to being in the same universe. TheD3xus (talk) 02:32, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Owner wise, yes. And I know NBC, CBS, and Fox are separate networks, haha. If Titans comes to see the light the light anyway. I think it would be most likely safe to speculate that they will put Titans in the same universe, as Roy Harper and later on Wally West are in the "Arrowverse", two founding members of the Titans. Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 02:37, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Sad to say that linking shows other than Arrow and Flash together is only fan speculation and is not grounds for this type of discussion. At this point there is nothing indication that Gotham, Constantine, the pending Supergirl, and rumored Teen Titans will be interconnected much less tied to Arrow.

For all the above, I see no problem with sticking to (Arrow), just like the current spate of direct-to-DVD animated films are falling under (DC Animated Movie Universe). It works based on the initial property in the continuity. It also reduces the need for re-working all of the material already present from 2 seasons of Arrow - including 3 of the principles on Flash - or confusion going forward with Arrow if that material is not converted.

That's beyond the fact that this is verging on "We, as fans, need to create a fan-use term for this." even though there little to nothing to justify it.

- Byfield (talk) 03:11, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Fair enough. Makes sense. Let's see what Hatebunny and Tupka have to say, although we will probably end up keeping everything as Arrow (and I happen to like that because I've also made all my edits under the Arrow universe. But we need to make Arrow a universe page instead of a redirect to the TV series.) TheD3xus (talk) 03:21, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

I completely disagree on the need to stick with Arrow (I also have problems with War). It just sounds incredibly clunky to have the Flash TV show be only a part of the "Arrow" Universe. For the record, I still don't see a problem with the "CW Universe", but I would be fine with almost any neutral Universe name (i.e anything other than "Arrow"). Not changing anything out of convenience, just smacks of laziness at the expense of coherence. Like if this was 1996, we would have separate BTAS Universe and STAS Universe pages (Or Superman merely as a part of the "BTAS Universe"), just because it was "convenient". Also will we really, still keep referring to the DCCU as the "Man of Steel Universe" too? Blech Tec15 (talk) 06:02, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

^ I believe in Tec15. --- Haroldrocks talk 10:22, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

I definitely agree that Arrow (and War) don't sound right. Maybe (Arrow/The Flash Universe)? --Tupka²¹⁷ 10:40, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

Arrow/The Flash is fine, but it creates problems for page names. The slash in the universe name would put /Flash underneath Oliver Queen (Arrow. (Lack of closing parenthesis is intentional; that's how it would appear.) I still like CWU or CWNU. TheD3xus (talk) 12:33, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

My current favorite options are (2012 CW Universe), (CW 2012 Universe), (2010s CW Universe), (CW 2010s Universe) or (Berlanti Productions). DrJohnnyDiablo (talk) 13:52, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

I think we could make a forum post out of this, where we can highlight it and more people can voice their ideas. --Tupka²¹⁷ 14:30, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

https://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:410503

Shortening

Can we change this to just "Arrow", instead of "Arrow (TV Series)"? It makes a (sorta) distinction between the TV series and the universe, and it saves me the trouble of having to clean out Category:Arrow Characters every now and then. --Tupka²¹⁷ 11:03, December 14, 2017 (UTC)

Look, I don't care what we go with but this universe needs a name change especially now that Arrow is ending. We are calling a universe with 7 maybe 8 different shows Arrow (TV Series) (Arrow, Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow, Batwoman, Constantine, 1990s Flash and possibly Black Lightning) Also this would be a perfect opportunity to change the flash 1990s series label to earth 90 TheDemon08 (talk) 19:25, September 6, 2019 (UTC)

Oh and also you might want to do this before crisis lmao TheDemon08 (talk) 19:31, September 6, 2019 (UTC)