Talk: Kara Zor-L (Prime Earth)

Picture

Can we change the picture? This panel from Infinite Frontier #3 fits better. PMO180 (talk) 13:47, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Given that she's about to feature in the upcoming Lazarus Planet event, I suspect we'll be getting a better image than that soon, but in the meantime, I support it. Ømn1 (talk) 13:07, 7 October 2022 (UTC)

Already changed it. The one before was a placeholder group pic. --Tupka217 (talk) 13:10, 7 October 2022 (UTC)

Name

I know she said she doesn't have a real name, but did she mean that literally? MysteryScooby (talk) 10:17, 1 May 2023

It seems to me that it was just a metaphor as she considers herself a paradox. She IS Kara Zor-L, her whole background confirms it: in fact, she also jokes about Jon having to call her "Kara, Beta version" which acknowledges her past. Cmanigold 14:45, 16 May 2023

History

If I knew nothing of Power Girl, this section would not give me a sense of her origin, her time on Earth-Two prior to CoIE, her joined the JSA and Infinity, Inc., her time on New Earth, and so on. The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dmc1001 (talk • contribs).

That's a different version, it's complicated. We have links to the original in the notice at the top and the notes in the bottom. --Tupka217 (talk) 11:49, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

It very much is not a different version, by both explicit in-universe statement and writer statements. DC has stated in no uncertain terms that these are the pre-Flashpoint versions, and that the world has had its history restored. I know you're adverse to it, and I know it would be a titanic effort, but I don't think continuing to actively ignore what DC has told us in very clear terms several times is sustainable.

Generally, if we don't have seperate pages for pre-and-post Zero Hour or pre-and-post Infinite Crisis versions of characters (many of whom have just as signfiicant alterations to post-Crisis history and backstory than most characters do now), I don't think we can earnestly justify continuing on like this, in active defiance of of obvious truth.

At the very least, this is very clearly and explicitly pre-Crisis PG, the Power Girl who ended up on New Earth following the Crisis. Multiple recent plots hinge on this being true. Ømn1 (talk) 14:48, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

DC also told us she wasn't Kryptonian once.

This is, at most, a case of "some elements of the old version might be true but not necessarily all of them". --Tupka217 (talk) 17:39, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

I think we should merge this page with the Pre-Crisis Power Girl one, since technically they are the same Conner Kennt69 (talk) 17:58, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

The post-Crisis PG wasn't even the same as the pre-Crisis PG, that was only retconned back during Infinicte Crisis. The old page is currently for the pre-COIE, post-COIE and post-IC version. When you want to merge it, you would have to split off the post-COIE elements. Not everything about her life was true at one point or another.

The current page is definitely confusing because it's one of those horrid "every snippet of information" early life sections that lack a basic introduction to the character. Could do with a rewrite.

This calls into question all other JSA pages and that would just create a mess. Keeping the old page at (Earth-Two) when all the other JSA pages were at (New Earth) was already an anomaly.

You're welcome to write a detailed Power Girl is confusing page detailing the changes in her life in a more out-of-universe way. --Tupka217 (talk) 18:23, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

I think it's a good idea to create a page explaining the differences and retcons in the Power Girl canon, but I don't know enough about her history in the comics to make this page Conner Kennt69 (talk) 20:22, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

Well, I did some research on the character and created the page. If you want to change or add something, the page is here "Power Girl is confusing" Conner Kennt69 (talk) 16:10, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

So, we're keeping this page separate because DC retcons a lot? I think we should merge this page and only split when DC decides to retcon her to not be from the Pre-Crisis Earth-Two, which I don't think is happening anytime soon, because Earth-Two is a big part of Power Girl's history. The New 52 Power Girl came with her own Earth 2. And that time where she was Atlantean was just a way for DC to keep her around when Superman had to be the last Kryptonian. SeanWheeler (talk) 01:39, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

Main Image

Can someone put the image File:Kara Zor-L Prime Earth 003.jpg as the main Image of the page? Conner Kennt69 (talk) 18:01, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

No, just no. Wrong ratio, cut off panel, cut off word baloon... --Tupka217 (talk) 18:04, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

I would like to poropor that we changed the current image for File:Power Girl Vol 3 1 Variant 1 Textless.jpg (the current look of the character) Also have the options File:Action Comics Vol 1 1053 Variant 1 Textless.jpg, File:Power Girl Vol 3 1 Variant 2 Textless.jpg, File:Power Girl Vol 3 1 Variant 3 Textless.jpg Conner Kennt69 (talk) 23:43, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

I hate that none of them look like comic book art, but fine. --Tupka217 (talk) 09:08, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Her and Earth 2

Is there a reason this page can't be merged with "Kara Zor-El (Earth 2)"? I know, different name, but this seems like she's just been retconned into being like her Earth-Two variant, similar to Superman and Kon-El practically turning into their New Earth counterparts.

Main Image

I suggest we change the main image to Power Girl Vol 3 1 Variant 2 Textless.jpg or Power Girl Vol 3 1 Variant 3 Textless.jpg, mostly because the current one has somewhat awkward proportioning with the legs (no disrespect to the artist) while these also show her in a more classic costume, and the jacket look doesn't seem like its been very consistent for even this specific version. The second variant is a bit clearer although it does have a kind of boring background and pose, while the third one has a brighter background and more dynamic pose. I don't mind which, I just think a change would make sense. The preceding unsigned comment was added by Projekt Taku (talk • contribs).

Sure. --Tupka217 (talk) 16:44, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

Changes to the Page

I propose three unrelated changes to this page, and I would like to know which ones people don't agree with?

1. The one that bothers me the most it that there's a lot of information in the Overview, Origin and Early Career sections using references that simply don't state any of that. This should be removed. I've already replaced the references with citation tags, but if someone reverts this, check this change.
2. If Kara was only restored in Doomsday Clock Vol 1 12, she cannot have her first appearance before Doomsday Clock. I think that's pretty obvious. Of course there are exceptions, like Jay Garrick, because of the Speed Force, but Kara is not like that. Most of all, though, I don't understand why her two "earliest appearances" aren't considered Earth 2 Kara.
3. Earth-Two did not have two Karas, so either this should be merged with the OG Power Girl (which I also don't agree, because, otherwise, she wouldn't have been influenced by Doomsday Clock), or this one cannot be said to be from Earth-Two, even if she has some memories of it.

Pedronog (talk) 15:11, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

1. The origin is from Power Girl Special #1. I fixed the ref.
2. Power Girl is confusing and the Heroes4U phase is an anomaly.
3. Explained above.--Tupka217 (talk) 18:28, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

I think this should merge with the OG Power Girl. This article mentions stuff about the crisis which is the multiverse before Flashpoint. She's clearly not native to Prime Earth. Could you explain how she was influenced by Doomsday Clock and why the original Power Girl wouldn't have been? SeanWheeler (talk) 20:54, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

That may all be true but for practical reasons it's better not to. --Tupka217 (talk) 21:19, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

SeanWheeler, Doomsday Clock revealed that Jon had made it so that the Justice Society never existed post-Flashpoint, in a reality the book calls Earth-52, which is no other than the "Prime Earth" before Doomsday Clock. He visited Earth-One, Earth-Two and Earth-1985 (which the wiki calls New Earth), but he didn't alter those. They just followed their own course as separate realities. At the end of Doomsday Clock, Jon reverts the changes he made, creating a reality similar to Earth-52, but in which the Justice Society existed in the early 20th century, which is our current Earth-0 or Prime Earth.

This means that, if PG had in fact been from the OG Earth-Two, she wouldn't have been affected by Jon's tempering as her arrival from a different Earth would have happened whether or not he intervened. Also, she would have to be visibly older and not the young adult we currently have, unless she doesn't age at all.

So, she can't be OG Power Girl. Now the problem is the way she is currently treated: on the one hand, she has mentioned an "Earth 2" a lot of times, she's had a few visions of Kal-L, and remembers several plotlines from Pre-Flashpoint, but only some of them with clarity; on the other hand, it's been said she took refuge on Earth Prime after her own Earth was destroyed and she has been active since the 1970s. In my opinion, this means she was from the "Earth 2" created as the necessary counterpart to Earth 0 after Jon's actions, which would be very similar to the OG Earth-Two, but isn't the same. Furthermore, her other memories of pre-Flashpoint stories can be explained by simply assuming that several storylines from that era also happened on the current reality (this is not farfetched, and I think it's common practice in a lot of other runs). | Pedronog (talk) 23:13, 23 January 2025 (UTC)